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aaronpk_tv
Wednesday, February 20, 2019
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"User" has its own set of problems too, like connotations with drug use, which is particularly a problem when we're talking about making things that are alternatives to Facebook/Twitter which are known to create addictive behavior.
It's also not a term from an individual's perspective. People don't think of themselves as users of software, only the software authors do. -
Deerfield, Illinois • Wed, February 20, 2019 5:50am
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Chicago, Illinois • Wed, February 20, 2019 6:12am
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Chicago, Illinois • Wed, February 20, 2019 6:19am
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Chicago, Illinois • Wed, February 20, 2019 6:42am
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Larry Sanger
https://twitter.com/lsanger
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Feb 20
I think I’ve figured out the broad strategy for how to decentralize social media. How do we get people using new, better networks? Here’s how!
My latest: https://larrysanger.org/2019/02/how-to-decentralize-social-media-a-brief-sketch/ #socialmedia #facebook #twitter #foss #blockchain
@Everipedia
#decentralization #privacy
You should come check out what we're doing on the #IndieWeb, it's basically exactly this, built with many W3C standards! Here's a writeup about my current social media experience, I stopped using Twitter ages ago:
https://aaronparecki.com/2018/04/20/46/indieweb-reader-my-new-home-on-the-internet -
at BrookstoneChicago, Illinois • Wed, February 20, 2019 9:11am
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Chicago, Illinois • Wed, February 20, 2019 9:16am
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Larry Sanger
https://twitter.com/lsanger
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Feb 20
Neat! Do you have to use http://indieweb.com in order to “join the movement”? If so, it’s not decentralized. And it also needs independent standards, or it won’t have the ultimate effect—it’d remain a front end to existing services. Anyway, I will definitely read up on this.
You don't need to explain decentralization to me ;-) I am literally the author of several W3C specs that are being used to build decentralized social networks!
https://www.w3.org/TR/webmention/
https://www.w3.org/TR/micropub/
https://www.w3.org/TR/websub/
https://www.w3.org/TR/indieauth/ -
Larry Sanger
https://twitter.com/lsanger
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Feb 20
Neat! Do you have to use http://indieweb.com in order to “join the movement”? If so, it’s not decentralized. And it also needs independent standards, or it won’t have the ultimate effect—it’d remain a front end to existing services. Anyway, I will definitely read up on this.
Those specs are arguably not the best introduction to the concepts which is why I linked the blog post instead 😊 -
Everipedia
https://twitter.com/Everipedia
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Feb 20
hey aaron! you should create the indieweb page on everipedia, we can tweet it!
hmm I don't think I understand, there's already a page but it appears to be a copy of the Wikipedia page, which isn't actually a very good description https://everipedia.org/wiki/lang_en/IndieWeb/ -
Larry Sanger
https://twitter.com/lsanger
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Feb 20
I would love to read an analysis of how well this project satisfies the vision of a decentralized social media architecture. I might not be able to get around to doing such an analysis myself for a while.
Here's a diagram explaining the architecture of a typical interaction lifecycle. Each person is using different apps and different software for their websites, a key aspect to a truly decentralized and robust network.
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Larry Sanger
https://twitter.com/lsanger
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Feb 20
I’m quite aware that these are not new ideas. Lots of people have been talking about this sort of thing for years. It’s cool IndieWeb has made a start. Pretty exciting! I would like to learn more. Have you worked on my (4) and (5) at all, to make old nets forward-compatible?
Yeah basically 4 and 5 are covered by the idea of POSSE https://indieweb.org/POSSE but it works the opposite direction.
I'm writing this on my website, and it gets automatically copied to Twitter. I also am reading your replies in Monocle, my reader app. -
Larry Sanger
https://twitter.com/lsanger
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Feb 20
I’m quite aware that these are not new ideas. Lots of people have been talking about this sort of thing for years. It’s cool IndieWeb has made a start. Pretty exciting! I would like to learn more. Have you worked on my (4) and (5) at all, to make old nets forward-compatible?
This way none of my content really lives on twitter since it's all on my site. Twitter is just a channel for me to have conversations with people who don't yet post on their own websites.
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Larry Sanger
https://twitter.com/lsanger
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Feb 20
Suppose I don’t want to copy anything to Twitter, but I want to let people who are on Twitter read my microposts on Twitter. They’d need a browser plug-in to do that. This way, we help them seek beyond that ecosystem and enter a broader, encompassing network.
Yeah I do like that idea! I might have to experiment with something like that. All the pieces are already in place to have that work with the IndieWeb building blocks too!
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Larry Sanger
https://twitter.com/lsanger
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Feb 20
Suppose I don’t want to copy anything to Twitter, but I want to let people who are on Twitter read my microposts on Twitter. They’d need a browser plug-in to do that. This way, we help them seek beyond that ecosystem and enter a broader, encompassing network.
It would actually solve the issue with Facebook since they disabled their API and I can't post to it anymore. It'd be fun if my Facebook friends could still see my stuff! I'm just not willing to post there manually.
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Larry Sanger
https://twitter.com/lsanger
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Feb 20
But it does live on Twitter, right? I mean you have copied it there. I would rather not copy my stuff there if I don’t have to. I would prefer Twitter to die a long and painful death. Short would be OK too.
You are not giving people any incentive to leave Twitter, are you?
Maybe this example would help illustrate? Here's our conversation we've been having as far as I see it: https://aaronparecki.com/replies
It's true that I still need a Twitter account for this to work, but if Twitter disappears tomorrow I wouldn't care. -
Larry Sanger
https://twitter.com/lsanger
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Feb 20
Twitter and the other big networks steal our privacy. We want them to disappear (or reform) for that reason. So we need to give people ways to exit the digital plantation—plugins are essential to that goal IMO.
I agree, but a good first start is to treat it as ephemeral and own all of the content you post there so it doesn't matter if it disappears. I see you have a blog, so you can do it right now! Start posting there and use plugins to syndicate to Twitter!
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Larry Sanger
https://twitter.com/lsanger
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Feb 20
I might just do that.
I also wonder if there might be some value in making the standards interoperable with the Everipedia Network. It’s not just for encyclopedias.
I actually want to study the standards themselves too. Have they been endorsed/adopted by the W3C?
Wonderful!
Yes, three of them are W3C Recommendations! There's also a few more pieces to the puzzle that were created after the W3C group concluded, more details here:
https://spec.indieweb.org/ -
It's a bit complicated, but there isn't a "W3C entity" that can be interested. Instead, representatives of member companies have to show support, and there wasn't enough interest from companies to keep it going after the 4 year charter was up.
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Every W3C working group has a defined start and end date up front, and they have to be renewed explicitly. Twitter and Facebook of course aren't going to support the group, (not that they are members anyway), and the space is still new to other companies.
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Pretty pleased I managed to have this entire conversation with @lsanger on Twitter using only my own website and tools! Never had to visit Twitter or use any Twitter apps! Our #indieweb tools have come a long way! #ownyourdata
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Aaron Parecki
https://aaronparecki.com/
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Feb 20
Pretty pleased I managed to have this entire conversation with @lsanger on Twitter using only my own website and tools! Never had to visit Twitter or use any Twitter apps! Our #indieweb tools have come a long way! #ownyourdata
and here is my previous post pushed out to Twitter and visible on Mastodon! #indieweb #ftw #distribution
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Darius Kazemi
https://friend.camp/@darius
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Feb 20
@aaronpk This is echoing to a twitter account, yeah?
Yeah I have to have a Twitter account for this to work but my site just uses the Twitter API to push content there. -
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Chicago, Illinois • Wed, February 20, 2019 12:23pmBack again because they have the most lunch and drink options and the coffee is better than Starbucks and there are outlets at the table
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I mentioned in my #OAuth talk last week that I was working on a blog post describing how to add the Device Flow to any OAuth server, and I just finished the post! \o/ 🔐 https://developer.okta.com/blog/2019/02/19/add-oauth-device-flow-to-any-server
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Not at all! I wrote up a bunch about how this works here: https://aaronparecki.com/2018/04/20/46/indieweb-reader-my-new-home-on-the-internet
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Chicago (ORD) to Portland (PDX)toAlaska Flight 687Portland (PDX) to San Francisco (SFO)toAlaska Flight 1806Chicago (ORD) to Seattle (SEA)toAlaska Flight 23Seattle (SEA) to San Francisco (SFO)toAlaska Flight 304
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at Ice BarChicago, Illinois • Wed, February 20, 2019 2:31pm
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Jeena
https://toot.jeena.net/@jeena
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Feb 20
@aaronpk I'm guessing you might know better, with #OAuth is it possible to only get the info if the user is who they claim to be (but without a password) or is it also possible to get the info to for example which groups he/she is associated with (like admin, user, reader)?
Technically OAuth doesn't even give you user info, you're getting in to OpenID Connect/IndieAuth territory if you want that. As for groups and roles, those are super specific to the implementation so aren't really part of the standard at all. You can use OAuth as a framework to do this but you won't find much in the way of standards for it. -
Once hailed as unhackable, blockchains are now getting hacked - MIT Technology Review (www.technologyreview.com)"Blockchains are particularly attractive to thieves because fraudulent transactions can’t be reversed as they often can be in the traditional financial system."
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at Gate L1Chicago, Illinois • Wed, February 20, 2019 3:47pm
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Doors open for IndieWebCamp Austin at 9am on Saturday. We’ll have coffee and breakfast tacos. Full schedule and registration details: 2019.indieweb.org/austin ☕
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I've been stuck at the airport in Chicago since 6am. It's 5pm now. I've never been so happy to get on a plane. #travel #selfie #firstclass
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Larry Sanger
https://twitter.com/lsanger
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Feb 21
But you're still using Twitter, which (a) helps them and (b) gives your tweeps no extra incentive to leave.
If you made your stuff available only using a browser plugin that added your microposts to people's feeds, it would help make your open protocols go viral.
Wouldn't making my content available via a browser plugin that shows it on twitter.com still do exactly the thing you're talking about, not giving my tweeps a reason to stop visiting Twitter? -
Larry Sanger
https://twitter.com/lsanger
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Feb 21
Another strategy would be to put half of your tweets on Twitter directly, then tweet out that you have another n tweets that people *could* have seen here, but they'll have to install the plugin.
There is definitely already a *lot* of my content that doesn't make it to Twitter and you have to follow my website to see it. I hadn't considered actually promoting this fact on my Twitter account tho! Not a bad idea!
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Larry Sanger
https://twitter.com/lsanger
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Feb 21
No. They'd have to install the plugin, which demonstrates that the content actually resides elsewhere, outside of Twitter's control.
But then they literally have to visit Twitter to see it. I still think it's a cool idea and would help me stay in touch with more people but it still seems like only half a solution.
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Ravioli and Kale
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Ok legit question: How is @Gogo able to block sending and receiving photos in iMessage? I thought iMessage was end-to-end encrypted so it shouldn't have any visibility into what type of content is being sent over that channel.
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I guess? I don't know enough about the protocol and where the encryption happens to understand how that works.
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I guess I'm confused because I can upload photos to my website over https just fine but somehow photos in iMessage are blocked... 🤔 -
Plane
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Portland, Oregon • Wed, February 20, 2019 7:37pmSurprise I'm home
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oyam
https://micro.blog/oyam
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Feb 21
@aaronpk Is maybe iMessages falling back on SMS? If there is no support for MMS, images would be left behind, and only text making it through.
Nope I don't use a phone number with iMessage and all the bubbles are still blue. -
oyam
https://micro.blog/oyam
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Feb 21
@oyam @aaronpk Gogo recommends turning off iMessages in their guide, so I’d assume it has to do with that. It’s probably causing iMessages to fail completely and iMessages is falling back to SMS (unless you had that explicitly disabled?).
Actually wait no, SMS won't work at all in airplane mode because it disables the cell antenna. Gogo has a mode that explicitly enables iMessage, but without photos. -
ever wondered whether it's possible to measure the similarity between sets of ingredients in cocktails so you can conceptualize drinks in a connected graph, in which edges represent substitutions?
no? well, https://beta.observablehq.com/@tmcw/cocktail-similarity -
Tom MacWright
https://twitter.com/tmcw
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Feb 21
ever wondered whether it's possible to measure the similarity between sets of ingredients in cocktails so you can conceptualize drinks in a connected graph, in which edges represent substitutions?
no? well, https://beta.observablehq.com/@tmcw/cocktail-similarity
This is the best.
I often describe my second favorite cocktail, the Boulevardier, as a Negroni but with whiskey instead of gin.
